A Moroccan asylum seeker on trial for stabbing a pensioner to death in the street and attempting to murder a Christian convert in “revenge” for the Israel-Palestine conflict told police he would have killed “thousands” if he had a rifle, Teesside Crown Court heard.
Ahmed Alid, 45, is on trial for the death of 70-year-old Terence Carney, a stranger whom he allegedly stabbed in Hartlepool town centre on October 15 2023, eight days after the Hamas attacks on Israel.
Prosecutors said Alid first stabbed his Persian housemate Javed Nouri, 31, as he slept in his room in the Home Office asylum seekers’ accommodation in Hartlepool, and that the larger man fought off his attacker who then fled into the town centre where he stabbed Carney, a stranger who was out walking.
Jurors previously heard from the prosecution that Alid was motivated by “revenge” for Israel killing Palestinians and one of his housemates told police that the defendant was previously turned down for asylum in Germany.
After his arrest, Alid was taken to Middlesbrough Police Station, and the prosecution say that when asked about the initial attack on Nouri, Alid said in Arabic: “I swear to almighty Allah, if I had a heavy weapon, this would be thousands because they had killed innocent children.
“I swear to almighty Allah, if I had a Kalashnikov, I will use it to kill them to the last bullet, today before tomorrow.”
Nouri said he saw Alid had started to routinely carry a knife
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Using an interpreter, Alid confirmed he was responsible for stabbing Carney and Nouri and said if there was no ceasefire in Israel and Gaza “there will be a flood of innocent victims here in Britain”.
Alid, who spoke with a stammer during the police interview, also said: “There will be a big explosion in the UK because they killed innocent children.”
A video recording of the police interview was played in court which showed Alid become angry towards the interpreter and insult him shortly before detectives called the proceedings to a halt.
The jury has heard that two female detectives questioning him were assaulted after one of them tried to get between Alid and the interpreter when she became concerned about the defendant’s manner and that a panic button in the police station failed with defendant’s solicitor calling 999 from the interview room to summon help.
Previously, the jury also heard how Alid had previously cursed two housemates who had become Christians and called them “devils”, with his housemate Mr Nouri, via a farsi interpreter, telling police he had moved into the Home Office-approved accommodation around three months before the attack.
He said he realised “this man was extreme in his religion” and was a strict Muslim and challenged him about why Alid came to the UK and not to a Muslim country if he did not like how people lived.
Nouri said Alid broke into his bedroom in the early hours of October 15 and immediately stabbed him near his heart
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There followed a long struggle in which Nouri described being repeatedly stabbed as he fought off his attacker
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Nouri told police: “He would tell me his family is in Germany and they did not give me asylum there – ‘that’s why I came here’.
“(He said) ‘I am waiting to get a decision for my asylum and to bring them over here’.
“I responded that I pray for you so you can bring your family here because it is difficult to be away from your family.”
Nouri said Alid challenged the housemates over beer that had been left in the fridge, saying it should not be in the house.
He told police: “I realised he was an extreme Muslim, in his religion alcohol consumption is not good.”
Nouri said he saw Alid had started to routinely carry a knife and was scaring the other housemates and that he reported his concerns to the police as well as his housing bosses and the Home Office, and that he told a friend from church: “This guy [Alid] is very dangerous, he is a terrorist, he is not normal.”
Housing bosses warned Alid he would lose his accommodation if his behaviour continued, Nouri said. Nouri said he saw Alid one night in the shared kitchen watching coverage of the Hamas attacks on his phone.
“He was looking at the Hamas and Israel war and the fact that Hamas was killing Israelis and they are cutting children’s heads off and killing wives and shooting them,” Nouri said.
“He was sitting on the kitchen chair and checking the news on his mobile phone. He was laughing and every time they would kill somebody he would praise God.”
Nouri said Alid broke into his bedroom in the early hours of October 15 and immediately stabbed him near his heart and was shouting “Allahu Akbar” repeatedly.
There followed a long struggle in which Nouri described being repeatedly stabbed as he fought off his attacker.
He told detectives: “It was a nightmare, I was sleepy, I did not know what was going on, I was frightened, it was dark and he kept shouting Allahu Akbar.”
Nouri, who told detectives he was from Persia, said he converted to Christianity around two years ago and Alid would have been aware of that, given that Nouri went to church, drank alcohol and did not pray at home.
Asked to describe Alid, he said: “He was a crazy man, you didn’t need to have a sixth sense of knowing much. He had a long beard and he would shave his moustache.”
Their housemate Mohammed Karimi, also from Iran and a fellow convert to Christianity, told investigators Alid would curse them in the house and say in Arabic: “You are devils”.
Karimi told detectives: “I could ignore that but Javed could not.”
Asked to explain why he thought Alid would curse them, Karimi replied: “I am from Iran, a Muslim country. He hated when I was drinking (alcohol) or having a girlfriend. I am a Christian and Javed, he was a Muslim and he turned Christian.”
He explained the context of a Muslim using those curses, telling police: “When you see someone you don’t like, anyone who is not Muslim, anyone or anything who offends your religion, (they say) ‘Devil go away, you are a devil, God damn you’.”
Karimi said some Muslims had “no problems” with people from another religion.
“You have some Muslims like Ahmed, they just want to force you to be Muslim,” he said.
Alid denies murder, attempted murder and two counts of assault and the trial continues at Teesside Crown Court.
